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112
The Treasury just declared the U.S. insolvent. The media missed it | Fortune (fortune.com)
submitted 5 months ago by just_another_person@lemmy.world to c/politics@lemmy.world
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[–] FBJimmy@lemmus.org 67 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Not saying that the US isn't in fiscal crisis, I'm not at all qualified to say either way, but: Comparing government balance sheets to household finances is a age-old conservative folly designed to encourage the working class to support smaller government in order to reduce taxes on the rich - in other words, encourage the turkeys to vote for Christmas (or in this case maybe Thanksgiving?).

The fact is that government finances and household finances are not at all the same thing, for many reasons I'm not qualified to explain, but a couple of obvious ones:

  • Households can't choose to tax the rich to increase income.
  • Households can't print money.
  • Households can't secure low-interest loans that extend beyond their lifetimes (i.e. issue bonds).
  • Households don't typically find spending increases income (i.e. Government workers pay taxes, infrastructure investment drives growth which increases tax revenue, etc etc).

The UK Conservatives used this line of reasoning around 2010 and it's led to 15 years of growth stagnation with no real improvement in the debt situation.

[–] karashta@piefed.social 10 points 5 months ago

Monetarily sovereign governments literally are the source of their own currency and can never go insolvent.

[–] TipRing@lemmy.world 42 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

These yahoos are both from the Federal Fiscal Sustainability Foundation, which is a conservative Republican think tank with ties to ALEC. Nothing they say should be taken at face value. They only serve billionaire interests.

[–] kata1yst@sh.itjust.works 12 points 5 months ago

Yeah huge red flag when the only spending they're highlighting is social security, Medicare, and wages.

[–] altphoto@lemmy.today 27 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Remember... He bankrupted a casino!!!!!

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 16 points 5 months ago (1 children)

By design. He sucked out every penny of profit, stiffed all his workers, filed for bankruptcy, and stuck all his creditors with the bills. Then he did it six more times.

That wasn't incompetence, it was a successful Business Plan, taking advantage of legal loopholes. It worked once, why not rinse and repeat? It's the American way.

[–] ferrule@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The real question is, does he think he can run a legit business or is his only skill in stealing candy from the pockets of kids as they jump into life rafts of the ship he caused to sink?

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 4 points 5 months ago (1 children)

He thinks that exploiting the bankruptcy system IS running a legit business, and worse, he thinks he's a genius for doing it.

[–] ferrule@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I get that. But it is amazing when you see interviews of him back in the 90s and he very obviously couldn't run a business to save his life. It was always about scams and when called on it his brain would break.

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 1 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Right, while his casino bankruptcies were an actual business model, that was in the business he was actually best at - real estate development.

Whatever money he made on his bankruptcy scam, he lost on all those other stupid businesses, which were nothing more than stupid rich guy get-rich-quick schemes. Regular people get caught up in Herbalife or Mary Kay, but for a dolt like Trump, he has to blow big entry money on dumb businesses like Vodka, or Steaks, or a University, and lose his shirt.

[–] ferrule@sh.itjust.works 1 points 5 months ago

Exactly.

And when you start looking into his real estate development, the majority of them fall into two camps. Either he sold his name for the property and had absolutely no involvement in them because in the 80's and 90's Trump means "classy" OR he was the financial backer while others actually did the development and management of the properties. The vast majority of his failed properties were the ones he actually kept some sort of control over and since he doesn't pay his workers and wants to operate like a slum lord, all of those properties tended to fail.

If anything all he really did successfully was show how if you start out with a lot of money and have mildly competent people around you then you can make money.

[–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 22 points 5 months ago

First, Congress should pass the bipartisan H.R. 3289 — Fiscal Commission Act, sponsored by Rep. Bill Huizenga (R-MI), Rep. Scott Peters (D-CA), and 41 co-sponsors. Such a commission would force a public reckoning with the facts, the trade-offs, and the hard choices that restoring fiscal health requires.

Second, Congress should call an Article V Convention limited to proposing a fiscal responsibility amendment to the U.S. Constitution. H.Con.Res. 15, sponsored by Rep. Jodey Arrington (R-TX), would do exactly that.

Ah, the classic conservative austerity play: set up a false dilemma where the only alternative to a fuddy collapse is punishing the non-rich until they die.

[–] Trying2KnowMyself@lemmy.ml 16 points 5 months ago

Conservative debtslop

[–] Brkdncr@lemmy.world 13 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I don’t quite agree that the goal should be no debt.

Just like getting a loan to buy a house today pays out better over time, or getting an education loan works out better for everyone later, a nation going into debt makes sense.

It pays out better in the long run. In fact debt is one of the best exports we have. We take other peoples money to build infrastructure that accelerates growth, they get decent interest payouts.

[–] FuglyDuck@lemmy.world 15 points 5 months ago (1 children)

I think there does need to be some reigning in of spending.

We shouldn’t operate on an unbalanced budget as a normal course.

Keep in mind it’s mostly republicans blowing up the debt- tax breaks for people who don’t need tax breaks. Wars against people who weren’t a threat. Bailouts to company’s that then use the cash for a stock buy back… funding Israel…. There’s a shit load of problematic spending but it’s always health care and education and social safety nets first.

[–] CorrectAlias@piefed.blahaj.zone 5 points 5 months ago (1 children)

Sorry, the best I can do is gut healthcare, take the tiny amount of grant money that LGBTQIA organizations get, and give all of that money to the billionaire class. Oh, and invading another country, of course.

[–] frunch@lemmy.world 4 points 5 months ago

"Art of the deal"

[–] Trying2KnowMyself@lemmy.ml 7 points 5 months ago

Even without dollar hegemony, the USA is the issuer of dollars and could choose to print all of the money necessary to fully pay off their debt. They’re only interested in printing money to fund genocide, though.

[–] n7gifmdn@lemmy.ca 11 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago) (1 children)

"a $438.8 billion increase in federal employee and veteran benefits payable (now $15.47 trillion)."

I thought DOGE was supposed to save the U.S. all that?

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 5 points 5 months ago

No, DOGE was supposed to steal all our data.

[–] floquant@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 5 months ago (1 children)

The Government Accountability office can't hold the government accountable

The jokes write themselves

[–] BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today 1 points 5 months ago

When it's not working, it's working.